If..as my previous post indicates I believe..there is no biblical basis for the "The man has the final word in all things" marriage..how does a couple attempt to come to a final decision in issues where there is a difference of opinion? Does someone need to have a final word for there to be resolution?
There are ample examples of issues that would present such a dilemma. Where to spend holidays as a newly married couple or where to go on vacation or whether to take a vacation or not for that matter. Whether to buy a car or furniture or clothes might be another. What ground rules should there be for the kids keeping a clean room or having a time to get in from a date or whether to date at all are further issues where differing opinions may be held by a mother and father. [Not to mention the teenager involved in the problem.] Some couples might say they have NEVER argued/disagreed over things like that. I would have to say in fifty-one year of marriage we've argued/disagreed over every single one of them.
But certainly all the above issues are minor compared to things like whether or not to change jobs. [Either spouse] Maybe even whether a woman COULD/SHOULD have a job outside the home. Whether to move to a new pastorate or change churches or to buy a house or how to handle the money/income as bills are being paid. If someone doesn't have the final say, how can you EVER make a decision in matters like these? It's funny few people ever seem to say the woman SHOULD be the one with final say but the man SHOULD and that BECAUSE the scripture says so. NOW I've said the scripture doesn't support that position. Boy have I placed couples in a terrible predicament. I agree. I have. One in which it will take the Holy Spirit to work everything out. What a terrible position for us to be in. Right?
I'm going to approach this from an unusual perspective and one that is somewhat difficult to explain. But it is one that I teach in marriage seminars having hammered things out over fifty-one years of marriage to the same person. In this post I'm only going to set the stage for a couple of upcoming posts that will clarify. So bear with me in this introduction if you will.
I think it helps to remember that in every marriage you have three elements. I call them the "I" "You" and "We" factors. For the sake of this post I'm going to call the male the "I" [The first element] and the female the "You." [The second element] If Mary were writing this she could and would, I'm sure, reverse it for the sake of making sense from her perspective. But I'm writing so I'll do it this way.
The third element is the "We." So every marriage has an I/You/We to it. Each of the two individuals helping create a "we." It is also true that no marriage will have any healthier "we" than it does a healthy "I" and You." In other words, there can be no healthy "we" to any marriage without there being a healthy "I" and "You."
With that in mind let's suppose the "You" [female] is absorbed by the "I"[male] so that she looses her individuality or identity and the male dominates. [Having the final say automatically IS domination.] This guarantees that the "we" will suffer. I'll show how later but one thing is, were that partner to die or leave, [divorce..it does happen.] the "You" would have little sense of who she is as her identity would have been lost in a marriage.
I've seen this happen over the years, unfortunately, as I've pastored widows who were at a loss about decision making in life because "he always made the decisions." This is one of the reasons I'm convinced God never intended for any Christian's decision making identity to be lost in a marriage.
Likewise, if the "I" [male] is absorbed by the "You" [female] so that he looses his individuality or identity and the female dominates, [Having the final say automatically IS domination.] the "we" suffers with the same result as the above. In our culture the first is far more likely to happen than the second.
There can be a third kind of marriage of course, where the "I" and the "You are ONLY individuals and NEVER really build a "We" at all and the only thing they have between them are the children. The problem is when the children leave the nest, and they do, THERE IS NO "WE" that remains having never been built. They wind up as strangers sitting across the breakfast table from each other. That would get old quick it seems to me. Reports do say, by the way, that the fastest growing group getting divorced in our day is that group married 30 years or longer. I think I know why!!
But there is a biblical model for marriage. It is where a serving "I" and a serving "You" are always committed to building a serving "We" together. But always with a mutual respect for each other where neither has an automatic right to the final answer on any issue. They then raise children who grow up watching two mature, healthy adults live together under the Lordship of Christ discovering answers to difficult issues so they [The children] can grow up having an example of respect, get married, have kids, and reproduce after that kind. THAT is a long sentence AND a biblical definition for marriage in my estimation.
I would suggest you read this over again to have a grasp for the next installment. I also hope you will bear with me as I go into a teaching mode these next couple of posts. So next time I will add a few ingredients, stir the pot a bit, and try to cook up a serving of biblical and logical ways of sharing the marriage leadership where neither person is lost to the uniqueness and giftedness they bring to it. All of this under the Lordship of Christ and the power of His Spirit.
Paul B.
Tuesday, January 18, 2011
Friday, January 14, 2011
WHO'S THE BOSS?
It is interesting that the ONLY place in the New Testament where the word "authority" (Gr. exousia) is used with reference to marriage is in a verse found in 1 Corinthians 7 [verse 25] where Paul is addressing the abstaining from sex between a married couple. There he says such a decision is to be a mutually agreed thing and one made in "symphony" with each other. [In other words, the man's not the boss here.]
Passages like Ephesians 5:21-33, 1 Corinthians 11:3-16. Colossians 3:18-18, and 1 Peter 3:1-7 certainly all speak to several aspects of men and women relationships, in marriage and in the Church to mention a couple, but the Greek word for "authority" in never used BECAUSE AUTHORITY IS NEVER ADDRESSED in these verses. Terms such as "head" may be interpreted to mean "authority" but that is reading into the text rather than interpreting from the text. I repeat...The ONLY text in the Bible that actually uses the word "authority" (Gr. exousia) in the context of MARRIAGE is, in fact, 1 Corinthians 7:25.
This ought, it seems to me, to give pause to anyone holding to the commonly held position that "the husband has authority and the wife is to submit to it because the man has the final say or word in any decision." [The man's the boss.] Is that biblical? Is that actually found IN THE TEXT OF SCRIPTURE?
Not according to my good friend Jon Zens who has done a remarkable study on ALL the texts about men and women to be found in scripture. let me give you just a bit of what he says about it all.
Jon says it this way...
"First, 1 Cor.7:1-5 is the only place in the NT where the word “authority” (Greek, exousia) is used with reference to marriage. But it is neither the authority of the husband over the wife, nor vice versa, that is in view, but rather a mutual authority over each other’s body. 1 Corinthians 7:4 states that the wife has authority over her husband’s body. One would think that this would be a hard pill to swallow for those who see “authority” as resting only in the husband’s headship.
Second, Paul states that a couple cannot separate from one another physically unless there is mutual consent (Greek, symphonou). Both parties must agree to the separation or it doesn’t happen. The husband cannot override the wife’s differing viewpoint."
Jon Zens goes on to address this statement by John Piper who is a great preacher [IMHO] and has quite a following among those who hold to the "The man's the boss" mentality.
"John Piper suggests that “mature masculinity accepts the burden of the final say in disagreements between husband and wife, but does not presume to use it in every instance” (p.32). But 1 Corinthians 7:5 contradicts Piper’s maxim. If the wife disagrees with a physical separation, the husband cannot overrule his wife with the “final choice” (p.33). Such separation can occur only if both husband and wife are in “symphony” (unity) about such an action."
Jon Zens then has a personal conclusion he makes...
"Now, if mutual consent applies in an important issue like physical separation [sexually] from one another for a period of time, wouldn’t it seem proper that coming to one-mindedness would be the broad model for decision-making in a healthy marriage? In light of 1 Corinthians 7:1-5 I would suggest that decision-making should focus on finding the Lord’s mind together. Over the years good ideas, solutions to problems and answers to dilemmas will flow from both husband and the wife together as they seek the Lord in “symphony” (unity)" as a couple."
Mary and I have for several years now lived with the understanding Jon Zens is articulating here about decision making as a couple. Paul teaches that unless the couple can agree on a course of action, it cannot be executed. So our goal has been to come to some agreed course of action as a couple. How is that done? That will take another post. But that it CAN be done and SHOULD be done according to scripture is the point of this post. I'm convinced that from the bible TEXTUALLY one CANNOT support a "The man is the boss" mentality in marriage. It seems to me that is decidedly more cultic than Christian at it's heart
Paul B.
Passages like Ephesians 5:21-33, 1 Corinthians 11:3-16. Colossians 3:18-18, and 1 Peter 3:1-7 certainly all speak to several aspects of men and women relationships, in marriage and in the Church to mention a couple, but the Greek word for "authority" in never used BECAUSE AUTHORITY IS NEVER ADDRESSED in these verses. Terms such as "head" may be interpreted to mean "authority" but that is reading into the text rather than interpreting from the text. I repeat...The ONLY text in the Bible that actually uses the word "authority" (Gr. exousia) in the context of MARRIAGE is, in fact, 1 Corinthians 7:25.
This ought, it seems to me, to give pause to anyone holding to the commonly held position that "the husband has authority and the wife is to submit to it because the man has the final say or word in any decision." [The man's the boss.] Is that biblical? Is that actually found IN THE TEXT OF SCRIPTURE?
Not according to my good friend Jon Zens who has done a remarkable study on ALL the texts about men and women to be found in scripture. let me give you just a bit of what he says about it all.
Jon says it this way...
"First, 1 Cor.7:1-5 is the only place in the NT where the word “authority” (Greek, exousia) is used with reference to marriage. But it is neither the authority of the husband over the wife, nor vice versa, that is in view, but rather a mutual authority over each other’s body. 1 Corinthians 7:4 states that the wife has authority over her husband’s body. One would think that this would be a hard pill to swallow for those who see “authority” as resting only in the husband’s headship.
Second, Paul states that a couple cannot separate from one another physically unless there is mutual consent (Greek, symphonou). Both parties must agree to the separation or it doesn’t happen. The husband cannot override the wife’s differing viewpoint."
Jon Zens goes on to address this statement by John Piper who is a great preacher [IMHO] and has quite a following among those who hold to the "The man's the boss" mentality.
"John Piper suggests that “mature masculinity accepts the burden of the final say in disagreements between husband and wife, but does not presume to use it in every instance” (p.32). But 1 Corinthians 7:5 contradicts Piper’s maxim. If the wife disagrees with a physical separation, the husband cannot overrule his wife with the “final choice” (p.33). Such separation can occur only if both husband and wife are in “symphony” (unity) about such an action."
Jon Zens then has a personal conclusion he makes...
"Now, if mutual consent applies in an important issue like physical separation [sexually] from one another for a period of time, wouldn’t it seem proper that coming to one-mindedness would be the broad model for decision-making in a healthy marriage? In light of 1 Corinthians 7:1-5 I would suggest that decision-making should focus on finding the Lord’s mind together. Over the years good ideas, solutions to problems and answers to dilemmas will flow from both husband and the wife together as they seek the Lord in “symphony” (unity)" as a couple."
Mary and I have for several years now lived with the understanding Jon Zens is articulating here about decision making as a couple. Paul teaches that unless the couple can agree on a course of action, it cannot be executed. So our goal has been to come to some agreed course of action as a couple. How is that done? That will take another post. But that it CAN be done and SHOULD be done according to scripture is the point of this post. I'm convinced that from the bible TEXTUALLY one CANNOT support a "The man is the boss" mentality in marriage. It seems to me that is decidedly more cultic than Christian at it's heart
Paul B.
Tuesday, January 11, 2011
WHooopEEEEEEEE
Most of you know that I've just concluded a sixth surgery in three years. Surgery has become my middle name it seems. Many of you have called or written to encourage and tell of praying for me. Appreciated is the word from me to you.
I will admit that along the way the comments about it all have proven interesting. Among all the very caring and concerned comments there were a few, only a few, that gave me pause. It seems there are those out there who seem to assume that healing is our divine right if we'll just trust more or get more people praying. It's almost as if the NUMBER praying adds weight to an assurance that God will do so...heal that is. [I guess if I had, in fact, died on the operating table it would have been a testament to a total lack of faith or prayer.]
It is a given that so long as we're here bound to our "earth-suit" as Bill Gillham calls our body, there will be pain. The presence of sin is the basic reason for the presence of pain for sure, but, there could be other reasons for pain that we'll miss if we're not careful with our Western mindset as Christians.
In one of my blog post of long ago I wrote these words.."Someone has said that christians are the living stones of the true Temple God is preparing for eternity. That preparation, while for eternity, is done here during our sojourn on this earth. Rugged and shapeless the stones are at the beginning. But the hammer and chisel do their work. And, because these stones are living, there is always pain associated with the process." The end result is a life that fulfills His purpose NOT in spite of the presence of pain but BECAUSE of the presence of pain.
When I write this way I'm always aware that too much of the time, people have assumed that since Jesus came to give us" life and life abundantly" the presence of any pain is indication we're missing out on life. This, of course, is both sad and unscriptural. Jesus said "I've come that you might have life and life abundantly." But that "life" is not "bios" [life] but "Zoe." [Life] The difference is, one [bios] is simply the cataloging of events, [biography] while the other is an inner quality of life independent of ANY AND ALL CIRCUMSTANCES. The failure to recognize this may be the reason the Church of the third world may well know more of the power of God in their lives than does the western Church. It takes God's power to live life to it's fullest when the things around you are so painful and there is little worth celebrating. But it may be that such a painful backdrop is what will reveal whether it is "Zoe" one is living, as opposed to "Bios," which doesn't take Jesus to live at all.
Pleasure and comfort in life are not sinful. Don't hear me saying that at all. Do hear me say they may be the enemy of the best in life if we define life in their terms instead of the biblical terms of suffering. It is there [in suffering] His power is made perfect and true life can be lived beyond the circumstances that confound and confuse so many in these violent and hurtful times.
So, we can rest in His providence. If His providence brings pleasure....we shall enjoy it. If His providence brings pain....we shall embrace it. But He does not work without pattern or design. That whether pain or pleasure or a mixture of the two.
My good friend Bob Cleveland wrote me this yesterday and has become my closing illustration of it all.......Bob said..
"Had to see my family doc for followup on the liver enzymes, this past Tuesday. He said maybe we should repeat the CAT scan they did 12/2, just to see how all those enlarged lymph nodes and that shadow by the appendix are doing. Yesterday he calls and says the shadow looks like an "appendiceal mucousele" and I need to see a surgeon. And oh, by the way, you have a small abdominal aorta aneurysm; normal is 2cm, you're 3cm, we start talking surgery at 5cm so not to worry. He did concede, however, that the fact that my mother died of a ruptured abdominal aneurysm migh be somewhat disquieting for me.
Surgeon calls and says we had a cancellation so I saw him yesterday afternoon. He says yep, the appendix thing isn't dangerous but could be if we leave it there so let's get on with surgery. Well, that's fine but I'm on Plavix for the stent they put in last April so I need to be off that for 5 days before they'll carve on the body, so need clearance from the cardiologist for that.
They called him right then and guess what .. he had a cancellation .. so I see him at 11:45 this morning."
WhoopEEEEEEEE!
It is that final "WhoopEEEEEEEEE" that I'm talking about.
Paul B.
I will admit that along the way the comments about it all have proven interesting. Among all the very caring and concerned comments there were a few, only a few, that gave me pause. It seems there are those out there who seem to assume that healing is our divine right if we'll just trust more or get more people praying. It's almost as if the NUMBER praying adds weight to an assurance that God will do so...heal that is. [I guess if I had, in fact, died on the operating table it would have been a testament to a total lack of faith or prayer.]
It is a given that so long as we're here bound to our "earth-suit" as Bill Gillham calls our body, there will be pain. The presence of sin is the basic reason for the presence of pain for sure, but, there could be other reasons for pain that we'll miss if we're not careful with our Western mindset as Christians.
In one of my blog post of long ago I wrote these words.."Someone has said that christians are the living stones of the true Temple God is preparing for eternity. That preparation, while for eternity, is done here during our sojourn on this earth. Rugged and shapeless the stones are at the beginning. But the hammer and chisel do their work. And, because these stones are living, there is always pain associated with the process." The end result is a life that fulfills His purpose NOT in spite of the presence of pain but BECAUSE of the presence of pain.
When I write this way I'm always aware that too much of the time, people have assumed that since Jesus came to give us" life and life abundantly" the presence of any pain is indication we're missing out on life. This, of course, is both sad and unscriptural. Jesus said "I've come that you might have life and life abundantly." But that "life" is not "bios" [life] but "Zoe." [Life] The difference is, one [bios] is simply the cataloging of events, [biography] while the other is an inner quality of life independent of ANY AND ALL CIRCUMSTANCES. The failure to recognize this may be the reason the Church of the third world may well know more of the power of God in their lives than does the western Church. It takes God's power to live life to it's fullest when the things around you are so painful and there is little worth celebrating. But it may be that such a painful backdrop is what will reveal whether it is "Zoe" one is living, as opposed to "Bios," which doesn't take Jesus to live at all.
Pleasure and comfort in life are not sinful. Don't hear me saying that at all. Do hear me say they may be the enemy of the best in life if we define life in their terms instead of the biblical terms of suffering. It is there [in suffering] His power is made perfect and true life can be lived beyond the circumstances that confound and confuse so many in these violent and hurtful times.
So, we can rest in His providence. If His providence brings pleasure....we shall enjoy it. If His providence brings pain....we shall embrace it. But He does not work without pattern or design. That whether pain or pleasure or a mixture of the two.
My good friend Bob Cleveland wrote me this yesterday and has become my closing illustration of it all.......Bob said..
"Had to see my family doc for followup on the liver enzymes, this past Tuesday. He said maybe we should repeat the CAT scan they did 12/2, just to see how all those enlarged lymph nodes and that shadow by the appendix are doing. Yesterday he calls and says the shadow looks like an "appendiceal mucousele" and I need to see a surgeon. And oh, by the way, you have a small abdominal aorta aneurysm; normal is 2cm, you're 3cm, we start talking surgery at 5cm so not to worry. He did concede, however, that the fact that my mother died of a ruptured abdominal aneurysm migh be somewhat disquieting for me.
Surgeon calls and says we had a cancellation so I saw him yesterday afternoon. He says yep, the appendix thing isn't dangerous but could be if we leave it there so let's get on with surgery. Well, that's fine but I'm on Plavix for the stent they put in last April so I need to be off that for 5 days before they'll carve on the body, so need clearance from the cardiologist for that.
They called him right then and guess what .. he had a cancellation .. so I see him at 11:45 this morning."
WhoopEEEEEEEE!
It is that final "WhoopEEEEEEEEE" that I'm talking about.
Paul B.
Sunday, January 09, 2011
vtmbottomline UPDATE
I'm sitting here on this Lord's day [Jan 9th 2011] with my arm surgically repaired and in a sling wondering about blogging. The break has been long, associated with a great deal of physical pain, and has left me wondering whether I should, in fact, begin again or not.
On the one hand I personally needed the rest and not just from writing but from an atmosphere of vitriol that had generally developed among several blogs I follow and that with regularity. That atmosphere had NOT, gratefully, attached itself to this blog but had certainly done so in so many that my mind began to reflect a desire to disassociate entirely from ALL blog reading. I did just that.
On the other hand, I REALLY do enjoy putting my thoughts down in blog form and getting feedback on the issues that mean enough to me that I write about them. That said, I'm not sure of any recoverability that might be possible from such a long break. I never did have a large reading audience, not that it mattered to me at the time, but now think that the small one I did have may not be around any longer. I'm not sure honestly but what this whole attempt today MAY be an effort to see if it is still there. I'm not convinced whether or not I should or will begin again. This may be part of my attempt to find out.
So...I'll just ask you..What do you think?
Paul B.
On the one hand I personally needed the rest and not just from writing but from an atmosphere of vitriol that had generally developed among several blogs I follow and that with regularity. That atmosphere had NOT, gratefully, attached itself to this blog but had certainly done so in so many that my mind began to reflect a desire to disassociate entirely from ALL blog reading. I did just that.
On the other hand, I REALLY do enjoy putting my thoughts down in blog form and getting feedback on the issues that mean enough to me that I write about them. That said, I'm not sure of any recoverability that might be possible from such a long break. I never did have a large reading audience, not that it mattered to me at the time, but now think that the small one I did have may not be around any longer. I'm not sure honestly but what this whole attempt today MAY be an effort to see if it is still there. I'm not convinced whether or not I should or will begin again. This may be part of my attempt to find out.
So...I'll just ask you..What do you think?
Paul B.
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