tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post2511772235361132758..comments2023-10-24T07:03:42.942-05:00Comments on vtmbottomline: MOVING FROM THE TITHE TO GRACE GIVING----ONE MAN'S JOURNEYPaul Burlesonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17021178307705707423noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-287729357568048402010-05-07T12:01:07.314-05:002010-05-07T12:01:07.314-05:00Paul,
Good answer! I believe God would say the sa...Paul,<br />Good answer! I believe God would say the same about his Son.Rex Rayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06976501582240117188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-5062007873767841552010-05-07T07:07:12.801-05:002010-05-07T07:07:12.801-05:00Rex,
Complimenting my kids is NEVER off topic. ;...Rex,<br /><br />Complimenting my kids is NEVER off topic. ;)Paul Burlesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17021178307705707423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-17796445891151993412010-05-07T06:50:24.496-05:002010-05-07T06:50:24.496-05:00Delectation? I mean ‘deletion’.
It’s a shame whe...Delectation? I mean ‘deletion’.<br /><br />It’s a shame when you have to check what ‘spell check’ does for you.Rex Rayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06976501582240117188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-7119501321996974462010-05-07T06:42:13.288-05:002010-05-07T06:42:13.288-05:00Paul,
Hey! Your delectation put a smile on my face...Paul,<br />Hey! Your delectation put a smile on my face. :)<br /><br />Great post on Wade’s blog today. Huh? (I’m testing if you delete that off topic question.) :)Rex Rayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06976501582240117188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-63529035406121652032010-05-07T06:11:09.831-05:002010-05-07T06:11:09.831-05:00Rex,
Since your comment is on Wade's blog and...Rex,<br /><br />Since your comment is on Wade's blog and since it has no relationship to my post at all I did remove it. [Besides..putting me second..no way you get away with that... ;)]Paul Burlesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17021178307705707423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-87010869134141615372010-05-06T23:20:23.437-05:002010-05-06T23:20:23.437-05:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Rex Rayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06976501582240117188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-3939521977051983202010-05-06T06:01:10.405-05:002010-05-06T06:01:10.405-05:00By the way, Mrs. Austin, kuddos for the pictures o...By the way, Mrs. Austin, kuddos for the pictures of those three little guys. ;)Paul Burlesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17021178307705707423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-37444198977268479922010-05-06T05:22:47.883-05:002010-05-06T05:22:47.883-05:00Mrs Austin,
He doesn't. He has chosen to use ...Mrs Austin,<br /><br />He doesn't. He has chosen to use His follower's giving as a tool to spread His message around the world and to feed the hungry, provide care for orphans, and to heal the sick. You see many are helped by what we call ministries that are operated by people/families we assist as they live in other nations/places leading out in those ministries.<br /><br />In our Capital city in Oklahoma and in several other small towns here we have Children's homes, hospitals, Assisted living homes and Nursing homes all supported by that money.<br /><br />I have family members living in Chile who are paid a salary for their full-time work of establishing new churches. [people] My sister and brother-in-law lived in another nation for over thirty years doing the same thing.<br /><br />Then we operate disaster units that go wherever needed, such as Katrina, with food, clothes, and assistance.<br /><br />Plus the bookstores we fund to print and provide material for the churches that are cooperating with us in all these ministries.<br /><br />That is all on top of local churches that do in micro in their community what I've just described.<br /><br />I've not mentioned six Seminaries that we fund and operate to train men and women to do those ministries. Plus the Universities we operate that educate anyone who chooses to attend one sch as Oklahoma Baptist University and Baylor University.<br /><br />So really God doesn't need us OR our money. He is willing to allow us to be a tool to help people if we're willing to think beyond our own needs. So we really count it a privilage and opportunity to go beyond ourselves, having provided for our own, by giving together as Christians to get a ministry done in the lives of other people.<br /><br />But this giving we do is in response to His blessings on us, NOT because we have to [law] or fearful not to. [God'll get us if we don't as too many seem to think.]<br /><br />Thanks for stopping by.Paul Burlesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17021178307705707423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-50743813237617286452010-05-05T21:47:12.829-05:002010-05-05T21:47:12.829-05:00Why does god need money anyway?Why does god need money anyway?Mrs. Austinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-55733076433887210392010-05-05T14:59:39.911-05:002010-05-05T14:59:39.911-05:00Paul,
"I remember the days when the Pastor&#...Paul,<br /><br />"I remember the days when the Pastor's salary WAS half what everyone else's was."<br /><br />I too!!!!<br /><br />I remember the struggles of making ends meet to feed and clothe and school five children, all teenagers.<br /><br />No perks, no superannuation insurance, no long service leave, etc.<br /><br />I also remember that our sovereign God never failed in supplying our NEEDS!<br /><br />When my health failed and the doctor said I must retire (10 years before I should), we still owed $7000 dollars on our house loan, with no way of paying it.<br /><br />One day we had a phone call from the bank to say our loan had been paid out. Wow!<br /><br />And the word verification is "blessequ".Aussie Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16199918171163666399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-74286856503701044712010-05-05T06:47:19.604-05:002010-05-05T06:47:19.604-05:00Make that "privileged" and I DO NOW HWO ...Make that "privileged" and I DO NOW HWO TO SPEL. ;0)Paul Burlesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17021178307705707423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-78600946010141383932010-05-05T06:40:23.403-05:002010-05-05T06:40:23.403-05:00Rex,
Good point about Eli.
I remember the days w...Rex,<br /><br />Good point about Eli.<br /><br />I remember the days when the Pastor's salary WAS half what everyone else's was.<br /><br />There probably needs to be an honest balance somewhere between privilaged and poverty for full time Church staff. It might be wise to be sure it is reflective of others who are leaders in the church but are paid from other places of employment as well.<br /><br />My my, discussing the Church budget and it isn't even the fall. ;)<br /><br />Seriously, one of these days we might should come to see that we've created something that is foreign to scripture anyway with Church as we know in in America.Paul Burlesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17021178307705707423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-38472512725443993342010-05-05T05:55:13.270-05:002010-05-05T05:55:13.270-05:00P.S.
Just another example of “Will a man rob God?”...P.S.<br />Just another example of “Will a man rob God?” That Scripture that’s often quoted to push the ‘tithe’ has roots tied to those not in the pew but church leaders such as Eli and his sons. <br /><br />I think today of those pastors that have large salaries and perks that are ‘hidden’ from the congregation.<br /><br />Quite a contrast to a former pastor of ours that would only accept half the salary offered.Rex Rayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06976501582240117188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-87881722383538362202010-05-03T21:36:36.745-05:002010-05-03T21:36:36.745-05:00Dear IMB M J,
Another saying for the 10% tithe is ...Dear IMB M J,<br />Another saying for the 10% tithe is ‘The poor man’s burden and the rich man’s cop-out’.<br /><br />It’s a joy to hear or your giving and not through ‘rules or laws’.<br /><br />I was in a church once where it was expected for the deacons to give the 10% to the church and not any of it anywhere else.<br /> <br />In another church, the pastor gave a paper to the church stating: “A pastor must know whether or not the leadership tithes. If they do not, they do not belong in leadership.”<br /> And that pastor through careless driving damaged a church vehicle but never paid the deductible on the insurance.Rex Rayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06976501582240117188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-54904833494389322752010-05-03T17:03:35.553-05:002010-05-03T17:03:35.553-05:00Bob, J, and Aussie J,
You have made three very go...Bob, J, and Aussie J,<br /><br />You have made three very good responses to this. Thanks for doing so.<br /><br />J, <br /><br />I count it an honor for you to stop by and join so many that comment here that I deeply respect such as Bob and Aussie J. I hope you do it often and please give us the benefit and the privilage of hearing about and keeping up with whatever is happening where you are. <br /><br />May His blessings continue to be made known to you and yours.Paul Burlesonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17021178307705707423noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-63038029943655242112010-05-03T15:29:24.803-05:002010-05-03T15:29:24.803-05:00Paul,
How enjoyable to read something as forceful...Paul,<br /><br />How enjoyable to read something as forcefully, yet humbly stated.<br /><br />I have never taught tithing and have still seen amazing financial happenings in a congregation, and in the life of my family.<br /><br />If, when we become followers of Christ, He becomes Lord of all we have and all we are, how can we give Him 10% of what is already His?<br /><br />It is my firm conviction that much of what has become unbreakable tradition,is, as the good brother suggests,"... low-realm, obsolete and defunct and the pontificators of..." such, including"... tithing ultimately introduce weakness and confusion in the minds of believers."Aussie Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16199918171163666399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-50046731524433039252010-05-03T13:35:49.359-05:002010-05-03T13:35:49.359-05:00My husband and I decided more than a decade ago th...My husband and I decided more than a decade ago that we would no longer tithe....for some of the same reasons Dr. Chase listed. <br /><br />We were even more affirmed in this after working more than eleven years overseas in a third world country. When you see young believers being told they MUST give 10% but they're barely making enough money to pay for food and utilities....not to mention clothing.....that's wrong. When they're told that if they give, they will be blessed financially...that's wrong.<br /><br />The tithe is the poor man's curse and the rich man's blessing....can't remember where I heard this quote...but it's so true!<br />(The poor man is burdened and the rich man can hold onto the other 90% because it's his portion....)<br /><br />We encourage those we work with to give to the Lord....be it money and/or time.<br /><br />We encourage the church to see how they can minister to the poor and widowed...that is biblical. The church is to care for those in need....<br /><br />We don't make much as missionaries, but we believe the Lord has led us to give 15% (of our income) or more each month back to him. I wouldn't put this on anyone else...this is what God has shown us. In our time....who can measure that...<br /><br />Thanks for posting this....<br /><br />We have met others who feel this way, but not many people will talk openly about it. <br /><br />J (imb m)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28605099.post-80878328336014319172010-05-03T10:32:27.241-05:002010-05-03T10:32:27.241-05:00"...and the pontificators of tithing ultimate..."...and the pontificators of tithing ultimately introduce weakness and confusion in the minds of believers."<br /><br />Bingo. <br /><br />He presents a defense of his position, to which I would have no answer, if I were of a mind to do so. Which I am not, as I agree.<br /><br />The only thing he didn't mention, which has always nagged at me, is that the whole passage in Malachi seems (to me) to be addressed to the priests, not the nation. It wasn't all the "laymen" who flooded the altar with their tears; I think that would have been the priests. And as I understand it, they were to store 10% of the offerings at the temple, in order to feed the poor.<br /><br />Anyway, If I'm ever around Dr. Chase, I am keeping my mouth CLOSED. I'll too busy listening and too afraid of saying something stupid.<br /><br />:)Bob Clevelandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06110395869562328309noreply@blogger.com